Letby wanted first baby death 'out of the way'

Lucy Letby is serving 15 whole life terms for murdering babies on a neonatal unit

A nurse recalled the moment serial killer Lucy Letby told her she “just wanted to get her first death out of the way”.

The woman, granted anonymity and referred to as Nurse ZC, told the Thirlwall Inquiry into Letby’s crimes that she started as a newly qualified nurse at the Countess of Chester Hospital in 2012 on the same day as Letby.

Nurse ZC left the Countess of Chester to work elsewhere but returned in 2015, when Letby’s killing spree began, the inquiry at Liverpool Town Hall heard.

Recalling the conversation, she said: “[Letby] commented that she can't wait for her first death to get it out of the way.

“It took me aback because for me, the thought of having to experience that was something that actually, even though I was a trained nurse, you don’t actively want to happen.

“I just took it as she was trying to make conversation with someone she didn’t know.

“It wasn’t something I instantly thought ‘that’s alarming’, I just thought it was a bit strange that it was the sort of conversation she was having with me.”

Nurse ZC said she started to become concerned about Letby in June 2016 when she learned she had been present for the deaths of two triplets who died unexpectedly.

However she said she had already been subjected to a “smear campaign” after raising concerns about care in a case unrelated to Letby, so felt reluctant to report her worries.

Nurse ZC said she did still feel able to speak to deputy children's ward manager Nicola Lightfoot, and asked her: “Is this not concerning?”

She said Nurse Lightfoot “shrugged her shoulders” and she heard nothing further.

The Thirlwall Inquiry is examining the NHS's response to Lucy Letby

Earlier, a former friend of Letby said she still woke up questioning how she "was so blind” to what the serial killer was doing

Also anonymised as Nurse T, the woman said she was a mentor to Letby during two student placements at the Countess of Chester Hospital in 2010.

She said her initial impressions of Letby were that she was a “conscientious and capable” colleague, who was “obviously very intelligent”.

“She could seem quite aloof and quiet, quite a contained person, but I didn’t have any issues with her communication,” she said.

Asked to reflect on that period now, she said: "I sometimes now wake up and how can it be true?

"I know it is, things have come out in the trial and inquiry that have reaffirmed it to me, because I couldn’t understand how I was so blind to any of it."

The nurse was asked about a period in June 2015, when three babies died and one suffered a near fatal collapse.

She said the sudden death of a twin boy, referred to as Baby A, on 8 June and then the near-fatal collapse of his sister Baby B the following night was unlike anything she had experienced in her 25-year career.

The inquiry heard both babies were described as in a relatively good condition and fully expected to survive before developing an unusual skin discolouration and collapsing.

In messages passed between her and Letby, Nurse T had said: “Something odd about that night and the other three that went so suddenly.”

But the nurse said that while she considered the deaths unusual, she did not suspect anyone was deliberately harming babies.

She was asked whether she had been aware of the case of Beverley Allitt, a nurse who killed four babies in Grantham, Lincolnshire, in 1991.

Nurse T replied: “I was very aware of her, and I was very aware that changes were made to training and mentorship and, you know, I always took that very seriously.

"If I felt I had concerns about a student I raised them because I was aware that was one of the things highlighted from the inquiry after Beverley Allitt.

“It never crossed my mind that it could be happening on my unit.

“It was just so unbelievable, just so out of my sphere of my understanding.

"I find it so difficult to comprehend that anyone could do that, deliberately harm and kill somebody else, another person, never mind a baby that you’re charged with caring for.”

'Favourites'

The nurse also broke down in tears as she recalled being "bullied and intimidated" by the unit’s manager, Eirian Powell.

She told the inquiry that Ms Powell had an "adversarial" relationship with consultants and had dismissed their concerns about Letby as "nonsense".

She said the manager had a "dictatorial style" of management on the ward and believed she had "clear favourites", including Letby.

Nurse T said: "She made comments that Lucy would go far, she had a great career, earmarked her as a good nurse."

She said Ms Powell told her Letby was also "unfortunate" in that she did extra shifts and therefore happened to be there for more of the deaths, and that was the only thing the doctors had to "back up what they were saying".

Nurse T added that Ms Powell had said the doctors' decision to carry out an external thematic review in late 2015 of the increased mortality was "all nonsense".

Lucy Letby was first arrested at her home in Chester in 2018

After senior consultants raised concerns about Letby in July 2016, she was removed from the unit and given an administration role.

Letby, originally from Hereford, was convicted of the murders of seven babies and the attempted murders of another seven, including one she tried to kill twice, and is serving 15 whole-life prison sentences.

The inquiry continues.

Additional reporting by PA Media