Samuel Horti
Live reporter

Thanks for following our live coverage of this week's Sunday with Laura Kuenssberg.

Scroll down for a full catch-up on what happened: We had Brian Cox on Succession's finale, Labour's Jonathan Reynolds on the UK being "hooked on fossil fuels", and immigration minister Robert Jenrick answering tough questions about conditions for asylum seekers.

Join us again next week for another packed show.

Reporting today came from Jennifer Meierhans, Anna Boyd, and Catherine McGowan.

Serious clash between rhetoric and reality on immigrationpublished at 10:41 British Summer Time 4 June 2023

10:41 BST 4 June 2023

Laura Kuenssberg
Presenter, Sunday with Laura Kuenssberg

When it comes to how ministers handle the issues there aren’t many easy answers.

But there is any irony here.

For many years, and again this morning, Conservative ministers have said that they want to bring immigration down - whether channel crossings, illegal migration, or the overall numbers of people coming to the UK for work or study.

At the same time, they have presided over the numbers going up and up.

There’s a serious clash between the rhetoric and the reality.

• More analysis: Former home secretaries on why it's so hard to cut migration

Jenrick robust on migrants - but doesn't acknowledge asylum backlogpublished at 10:37 British Summer Time 4 June 2023

10:37 BST 4 June 2023

Laura Kuenssberg
Presenter, Sunday with Laura Kuenssberg

Making migrants share hotel rooms, putting them up on barges, or trying to find facilities on air bases - the government is trying more and more ways to accommodate the rising numbers of people who are coming to the UK.

The immigration minister, Robert Jenrick, was very keen to repeat his assertion that the government is taking a robust approach, and that by asking migrants to share rooms he wants to cut the costs to the taxpayer.

He was much less keen to acknowledge that the backlog for asylum claims is extremely high, and that compared to a few years ago, it takes much longer for cases to be resolved.

The problems with accommodation at 395 hotels around the country would be far less acute of course if there were fewer people stuck in the system.

If you're just joining us or want a recap: One of our key interviews was with immigration minister Robert Jenrick - here are some of the key things he said:

• He did not think it was unreasonable to ask male asylum seekers to share rooms to save on accomodation costs because "we've got to look after the taxpayer"
• He said barges and army bases were needed to house asylum seekers because hotels can't be the only option
• He insists the UK "can't be a soft touch" on illegal immigation and vowed "I will never put the interest of migrants above the British public".
• He says the asylum system is "riddled with abuse" and the government is overhauling it to deter people from arriving in the UK illegally
• He says net migration is far too high and he wants businesses to invest in British workers, instead of reaching for the "easy lever of foreign labour".

During the final panel discussion, actor Brian Cox admits he hasn't watched the finale of Succession.

He says: "For a start, I never like watching myself."

Cox adds that because of what happened to Logan he's been further "disinclined" to watch.

"It's a strange situation, I don't cling on to things."

Watch the video above for his full comments - but a warning, they contain spoilers for the final season of the show.

Laura asks the new head of the CBI, Rain Newton-Smith, if she will take a pay cut afer making drastic cost-cutting measures at the organisation - including losing a third of staff.

Newton-Smith replies: "We are looking at all the options... my pay is already not as high as my predecessor and what's important is we protect jobs.

"I've come back to fight for the organisation," she says.

That's the last interview of the show done - but we have plenty of insight from the panel.

Earlier, Laura asked CBI's new director general Rain Newton Smith what it's been like to take over following the sacking of former boss Tony Danker, which followed allegations of inappropriate behaviour by CBI staff.

She says: "It's been absolutely devastating to read about some of these instances."

She says she really believes in the talented people that work there - but that the CBI needs "the right culture and the trust of member staff and politicians".

Laura asks what she hopes to achieve from crunch talks with members on Tuesday.

She says she has a whole programme of change and she's seen "just how effective we are when we have a collective voice of business".

Joseph Wu finishes by talking about how misinformation is being used by the Chinese to influence people in Taiwan.

He says: “Misinformation, cognitive warfare, infiltration, all this type of hybrid warfare has been there in a very serious way in Taiwan.”

Wu adds that the Chinese are using it to sway Taiwanese people from the US and that “they try to shape the beliefs of the Taiwanese people”.

He says that he is concerned about the potential use of AI to spread misinformation, too. “People are worrying about the possibility the Chinese government will use those kinds of techniques to affect Taiwan’s national election,” he says - but adds that officials are "very alert" to this.

Laura asks Joseph Wu whether the US would assist militarily if China invaded Taiwan.

Wu says that Taiwan would need American assistance and says the US “has been helping Taiwan during this period of time”.

He says that the US has been selling Taiwan the necessary weapons for self-defence and is simultaneously training “soldiers to be adaptive to the modern warfare”, which he says is highly appreciated.

Taiwan’s foreign minister Joseph Wu says China-Taiwan tensions will “probably affect the rest of the world” - and trade is one of the big reasons why.

“Around 50% of the goods to the rest of the world goes through the Taiwan Strait, and any cut of flow through the strait will have a knock on effect on the circulation of goods,” he says.

Wu says that Taiwan is the main producer of semiconductor computer chips - used in most electronics, from phones to TVs - and “about 60% of the total output of the semiconductor products are coming from Taiwan”.

Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Company is the world’s largest company of its type and employs 65,000 people.

Earlier this week, Laura Kuenssberg spoke with Taiwan’s Foreign Minister Jaushieh Joseph Wu.

Let’s hear what he had to say about tensions with China and the need for assistance from the West.

Reynolds is asked if the Labour party would work with the CBI again (CBI's new director general Rain Newton-Smith is on the panel today).

The group is fighting for survival after allegations of rape and sexual assault against staff.

He says: "The events at the CBI were incredibly serious... but I do think this country needs a signficant, national business voice."

That's the end of the interview.

Reynolds says we can't protect the energy security of the UK by staying "hooked on fossil fuels".

He says embracing this big opportunity is so important - and that this is a big economic transition.

Asked if he can guarantee oil and gas jobs will not be lost in the North Sea, he says: "I can guarantee there will be further job opportunities, more jobs created in the energy sector in Scotland from our plans and that's true for every part of the UK."

Pushed on whether this means jobs will be lost he says: "We will not be revoking existing production". He says Labour had no plans to revoke licences to extract or gas from the North Sea.

It's put to shadow business secretary Jonathan Reynolds that some people believe his party's green ambitions will put jobs at risk in Scotland, with its North Sea oil and gas fields.

Reynolds insists Net Zero is a massive jobs opportunity - and "we're blowing it at the minute under the Conservatives".

In the North Sea, existing projects will continue, he says - but new fields are not the answer.

"They're a climate disaster," he says.

The future is in renewables and new technology, which will create a lot more jobs, including surveryors, technicians, and lots of related areas, he says.

Laura begins her interview with Jonathan Reynolds by asking him if he knew about concerns about Swansea West MP Geraint Davies, who was suspended by the Labour Party following reports by the Politico website of "completely unacceptable behaviour".

Reynolds replies: "No I didn't... this is completely unacceptable to hear about allegations of this kind and we are determined to face them down."

Laura says less than a month ago she had to ask him about an allegation of assault against a Labour front bencher, and a Labour adviser who was found to have acted inappropriately.

She asks if Labour has a problem.

Reynolds says the action taken has been swift and that the complaints process has been improved.

We’ll now be hearing from Labour’s Jonathan Reynolds.

The shadow business secretary will likely be asked about his party’s decision to suspend Swansea West MP Geraint Davies following reports by the Politico news website of “completely unacceptable behaviour”.

Let’s hear what he has to say.

Let's return to a key section of Robert Jenrick's earlier interview.

He was commenting on a story of a group of migrants who apparently refused to use a Pimlico hotel where the Home Office had asked them to sleep "four people per room".

Jenrick says: "As I understand what happened here was that these migrants, who had themselves said that they were destitute, they had nowhere to stay, we had offered them a safe bed with board and lodgings in a good-quality hotel in central London... These are single adult males, I don't think that's unreasonable.

"We've got to look after the taxpayer here."

Laura is chatting to the panel about what we've just heard - and actor Brian Cox says he "absolutely" agrees with Tom Hollander that striking writers in the US should "go for it".

Cox says: "They are the prime forces of what we do - we can't do anything without the writers".

He adds: "Unfortunately producers are the ones who behave rather badly, they are the ones who are the manipulators and sometimes the writers get pushed to the tap end of the bath.

"It's time they asserted their rights," he says.

The huge successes of The White Lotus and Succession is down to the writers, he says - "they're the ones who have done it."

On the wealth and opulence depicted in these shows he says "everybody loves to hate and these are extremely hateful people".

Laura’s interview with actor Tom Hollander finished on the TV and film writers’ strikes in the US and she asks him what he thinks of what’s going on.

He says: “Writers are the most important people. They’re the primary creators and without them there’s nothing.

“They need to fight their corner and if AI is about to replace everyone's scriptwriting lives then they need to hold their ground.”

He says he finds it “fascinating“ that in the US ”the unions have real block power which we no longer have here”.

Actor Tom Hollander has recently starred in the Netflix hit series The White Lotus, a dark comedy drama following the staff and super-rich guests at an exclusive holiday resort.

Laura asks what it is about the show’s depiction of luxury and opulence that made it so popular - when many people face a cost of living crisis.

Hollander says: “It’s probably people are fascinated by people they hate and we are in a potentially revolutionary moment in which some people have become so obscenely wealthy that the rest of the world can only gawp at that.

“And if The White Lotus gives you a chance to laugh at them and watch them suffer it’s sort of horror fascination isn’t it?”