Summary

  • Rishi Sunak says the UK government's plan to send illegal migrants to Rwanda is lawful

  • The prime minister tells the Liaison Committee the government will "vigorously" challenge a court ruling last week, which found the opposite

  • As well as immigration, Sunak is questioned on the cost of living, the war in Ukraine and mortgage rates

  • Asked about the economy, Sunak says he is focused on bringing down inflation but adds it is proving harder than anticipated

  • On Ukraine he says long-term security support is needed for the country, adding that he believes its "rightful place" is in Nato

  • In a fiery exchange, Labour's Sir Chris Bryant asks Sunak if he respects Parliament, accusing him of failing to attend votes sanctioning Tory MPs including Boris Johnson

  • And on the subject of resignation honours lists, which caused a row between Sunak and Johnson recently, Sunak says he has not given any thought to whether he will issue one himself

  1. Sunak says his government wants to work together with Scotlandpublished at 15:31 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    The SNP's Pete Wishart begins by saying that the relationship between Westminster and the Scottish government has "never been so poor" and is characterised by "mistrust, antagonism and suspicion".

    What are you personally doing to repair the relationship, Wishart asks?

    Sunak says he's met devolved leaders - including Scotland's First Minister Humza Yousaf - and says he will continue to try to work collaboratively together while acknowledging that they're not going to agree on everything.

  2. PM asked if he would issue an honours listpublished at 15:28 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    We've had a rare outbreak of laughter in the committee room.

    The PM is asked if he is reviewing the resignation honours list provided by former Prime Minister Liz Truss, but he says he hasn't received one.

    Then Wragg asks the PM if he would think it appropriate for himself to issue an honours list - implying in his question that his first opportunity to do so might be if he loses the next election.

    The PM says it's not an issue he has given any thought to. Cue chuckles all around.

  3. BBC Verify

    Is the asylum backlog coming down?published at 15:26 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    As we reported earlier, the prime minister told the Liaison Committee that the government has reduced the "legacy" asylum backlog by about a fifth.

    The "legacy" asylum backlog refers to all the people who put in a claim for refuge in the UK before 28 June 2022 and are still waiting for a decision.

    Sunak is correct that this backlog has reduced by fifth. However, for every legacy case cleared, another case has joined the queue.

    As a result, since December, the total number of cases in the backlog has actually increased slightly and, in the latest figures, external, stands at nearly 138,000.

  4. When would a resignation list be inappropriate, PM askedpublished at 15:24 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    Wragg presses on, asking if there are any circumstances in which a resignation honours list wouldn't be appropriate.

    Sunak reiterates that he believes he fulfilled his constitutional role in following convention by forwarding on Boris Johnson's list, that had been vetted for approval, without interfering.

  5. Long-standing conventions on PM resignation honours followed - Sunakpublished at 15:24 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    Wragg asks about Sunak's understanding of resignation honours and the nomination of peers to the House of Lords - a timely subject considering the drama surrounding Boris Johnson's nominations a few weeks ago, when Sunak was accused of leaving a few names out of his predecessor's list.

    Sunak says he understands that ex-prime ministers are entitled to resignation honours.

    He adds that he follows the "long-standing convention" of forwarding the names to Buckingham Palace after the normal vetting process "without any active involvement, engagement or interference."

  6. Does the PM fear 'the blob?'published at 15:19 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    Tory MP William Wragg is asking the PM about "the blob" - a term which has been used by some ministers to describe elements of the civil service it claims have thwarted its policy efforts. Does the PM recognise that characterisation?

    No, he answers simply. Asked where he thinks that outlook comes from, Sunak says not from him, and thanks civil servants he's worked with throughout his career who have worked day and night to bring government policy to life.

    Wragg asks if the term "the blob" is used to deflect from weak ministers, but the PM says that relations between officials and elected politicians have always been good in his experience.

  7. PM sets out help for struggling mortgage holderspublished at 15:18 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    Asked about the kind of support that is in place for people whose mortgages are coming under review towards the end of 2024, Sunak says people can do things like extend their mortgage to cut down monthly payments or switch to an interest-only period to cut payments.

    Again he says there are practical examples to help people who need it, which are being overseen by the government.

  8. What is the government doing about food insecurity?published at 15:17 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    McKinnell says one in seven people are going without food because they lack the funds. What level of food insecurity do you accept in this country, she asks, and what is the government doing about it?

    I don't want anybody to live in food insecurity, responds Sunak.

    He highlights that his government is helping vulnerable families in various ways - including by paying energy bills (worth £1,500), giving direct cost-of-living support through the welfare system, and additional payments for pensioners.

    He says these are part of several measures to help people with the cost-of-living crisis that "deliberately and specifically" target the most vulnerable, showing that the government is taking the issue seriously.

  9. PM pressed on low growth and high inflationpublished at 15:15 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    Labour's Catherine McKinnell asks if Sunak will take responsibility for the UK having the lowest growth forecasts and highest inflation in the G7 - without referencing the source of the figures.

    In the most heated exchange of the hearing so far, the PM pushes back against the figures she quotes, which he attributes to the International Monetary Fund (IMF).

    McKinnell presses him again on the projections, but Sunak says the IMF said it's important not to only look at the year ahead when talking about growth, and the projections for the British economy improve after that.

  10. Labour MP asks about frozen housing benefit levels?published at 15:11 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    Betts says that since 2020 the Local Housing Alliance (which helps the poorest families pay rent in the private sector) has been frozen - but at the same time, rent in the private rent sector has risen by 25%.

    How is it fair for government policy to impact on the poorest people, he asks.

    Sunak says he can't remember specifically but thinks that before it was frozen, the benefit had been risen by a "significant amount".

    He also points to discretionary housing payments and the affordable housing programme.

  11. How will the government meet its 300,000 new homes target?published at 15:01 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    Betts asks how can the government meet its goal of delivering 300,000 new homes if housing targets in local areas - that are supposed to add up to that number - are being slashed.

    Sunak says that his government is delivering some of the highest new housing figures in three decades - which is something that shows the government's approach is working.

    Media caption,

    Clive Betts MP asks the PM if local planning vetoes affect building new homes

  12. Is the UK building enough new homes?published at 14:59 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    Labour's Clive Betts is asking the PM about rising housing costs and the shortage of housing stock.

    He asks how the government can expect to hit its house-building target of 300,000 a year nationally after it scrapped rules which compelled local councils to build a certain number of homes.

    Sunak says he's encouraged by the figures and is confident the goal of building 1 million properties during this parliamentary session.

  13. Sunak acknowledges mortgage difficultiespublished at 14:58 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    Baldwin asks Sunak if he's confident about the Bank of England's decision to keep raising bank rates, which she says affect mortgage payers in particular.

    Sunak says it's not right for him to comment on monetary policy but acknowledges the difficulty of rising interest rates for mortgage holders.

    Asked about banks making sure savers benefit from higher interest rates, the PM says the issue "needs to be resolved".

    He adds that the Financial Conduct Authority had “agreed to deliver better deals to savers by driving competition and increasing reporting".

  14. I support Bank of England's models - Sunakpublished at 14:58 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    Baldwin asks Sunak if he is confident in the Bank of England's modelling to bring inflation down.

    "Yes of course I support them", says Sunak. He points out that the track record of the independent central bank in keeping inflation down over the past two decades has been very strong.

    "I don't think anyone thinks we should return to a world where the government is setting interest rates," says Sunak.

  15. PM asked how confident he is on inflation targetpublished at 14:52 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    Baldwin says the Bank of England has told the Treasury it will review its forecasting models after some predictions were wide of the mark.

    Asked what percentage chance he'd put on the inflation target being hit, the PM refuses to be drawn to put a number on it.

    Sunak says he's 100% focused on bringing down inflation and will use every measure available in order to achieve the target, because the effect of rising prices is hitting households, especially poorer ones.

  16. Will PM get inflation down, asks Tory MP?published at 14:51 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    We've moved onto the cost-of-living crisis and Conservative MP Harriett Baldwin says we're halfway through the year and the PM wants to halve inflation by the end of 2023.

    "What probability would you assign to you achieving that goal", she asks.

    Sunak says he is committed to bringing inflation down but adds that it is proving harder than people anticipated.

    He says the government has the right policies to solve the problem and must continue to stick to the course. If we don't do that, inflation will get worse which is not good for anyone, he says.

  17. Legacy backlog numbers down by 'almost a fifth' - Sunakpublished at 14:50 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    Dame Diana now moves onto another one of Sunak's promises, and reminds him he had earlier pledged to clear the "legacy backlog" - in reference to the number of asylum cases in the UK.

    Dame Diana says the national audit office however has found that decisions aren't being made to allow this to happen.

    "What's going wrong?" She asks.

    Sunak responds by saying the numbers have gone down by "almost a fifth".

  18. Sunak asked how many people Rwanda can takepublished at 14:49 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    The PM continues to say the deal with Albania is an example of other actions the government is taking on illegal migration, but Dame Diana points out Afghans are the biggest group arriving in small boats.

    She says that since the Illegal Migration Bill was introduced, 8,128 have crossed the Channel. Rwanda has said it can take 500 people, she says - what will happen to the rest?

    The PM disputes that figure. He says he won't talk about the details of the commercial contract with Rwanda, but says the arrangement doesn't include a cap on numbers.

  19. Small boats plan not on hold, says PMpublished at 14:42 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    Dame Diana Johnson asks if, given the Court of Appeal's recent judgement on the PM's Rwanda plan, his attempts to stop small boats crossing the channel are on hold until the legal battles are complete.

    Sunak insists his plan is not on hold and points to the government's deal with Albania.

    He says that deal is working and points to a reduction in the numbers coming from the country.

  20. Rwanda policy plan a 'gamble' - Labour MP Dame Diana Johnsonpublished at 14:41 British Summer Time 4 July 2023

    Labour's Dame Diana Johnson asks about Sunak's plan to appeal the court ruling that the government's Rwanda policy for asylum seekers was unlawful. What happens, asks Johnson, if that appeal fails?

    Sunak reiterates that he believes the "plan that we have is legal", saying the government would challenge the ruling "vigourously".

    Johnson says the government's plan hinges on the Supreme Court upholding the Rwanda policy. "Well it's a gamble, isn't it?" she says.

    Media caption,

    Dame Diana Johnson asked the prime minister if he has a plan if the court appeal fails