Summary

  • Defence Secretary Grant Shapps has said it would be "crazy" not to rethink the HS2 rail project in the light of inflation and soaring costs

  • He told Victoria Derbyshire, filling in for Laura Kuenssberg this week, that the government is weighing up whether HS2 still works for the country

  • Shapps said that when the original targets was made, under then-prime minister Boris Johnson, a war in Ukraine and cost of living crisis had not begun

  • He also defended the delay to some green policies, saying he was confident the government would achieve net zero by 2050 - a law-binding agreement

  • Lib Dem leader Sir Ed Davey, also on the programme, said the UK should be at the "heart of Europe" but wouldn't commit to rejoining the EU

  • And Labour's Darren Jones said the UK needs a "better working relationship" with the EU

  1. Goodbye for nowpublished at 11:46 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Sam Hancock
    Live reporter

    Another Sunday morning (almost) done, and with it another Sunday with Laura Kuenssberg - presented this week by Victoria Derbyshire.

    Today's guests covered a wide range of topics, with everything from HS2, environmental policies, housing, Brexit and - of course - the next general election being spoken about.

    • If you want to read more about what was said on this morning's show, head to our main news story here
    • It feels as though HS2 is going to be the political talking point of the next few days, so if you want to read more about the fresh criticism you can do that here
    • And for all of BBC News' political content, simply head this way

    That's it from us, thanks for following along. Today's page was brought to you by writers Thomas Mackintosh and Ali Abbas Ahmadi, and edited by myself, Nadia Ragozhina and Samuel Horti.

  2. WATCH: We'll stand shoulder to shoulder with Ukraine - Shappspublished at 11:31 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    One final clip to bring you from today's programme, this time from Grant Shapps.

    In his remit as defence secretary, he answers whether next year's US presidential election will have any impact on funding to help Ukraine in its war against Russia.

    Shapps reaffirms that the UK will "stand shoulder to shoulder" with Ukraine for as long as it takes.

    Have a watch below.

  3. Labour and Lib Dem coalition 'very unlikely' - Cablepublished at 11:18 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Sir Vince CableImage source, PA Media

    More political views to bring you now, this time from the former leader of the Lib Dems who feels a coalition deal with Labour after the next general election is "very unlikely".

    Speaking to Paddy O'Connell on BBC Radio 4's Broadcasting House, Sir Vince Cable was asked about the possibility of a Labour-Lib Dem coalition government. Here's what he said:

    Quote Message

    The experience that I and my colleagues had...was that it was very good for the country, we provided good government.

    Quote Message

    But, it was bad for the party and I expect that party membership will not be enthusiastic about a coalition.

    Quote Message

    Should we find ourselves in a position where the Labour Party has no overall majority, there will be an examination of the different ways in which we can help government to be stable and do things and run the country properly... but I think coalition itself is very unlikely."

  4. WATCH: Davey on EU - We remain pro-Europeanpublished at 11:08 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Plenty of questions were angled at Sir Ed Davey on the Lib Dem stance on the European Union.

    As has been reported this morning, according to the party's leader the Lib Dems would seek "root-and-branch" reform of the UK's post-Brexit relationship with the EU rather than "tinkering around the edges" of the existing deal.

    He told the programme the Lib Dems remain a pro-European party.

    Have a watch of the exchange below.

  5. The many political lives of Grant Shappspublished at 10:55 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Grant Shapps holding a red binder outside Downing Street in January 2023Image source, EPA

    Grant Shapps was asked about a wide range of topics today because he has worn many political hats since he was elected as an MP in 2005.

    Here’s a rundown of the positions he’s held in the last year - and the key ones leading up to them.

    • Aug 2023 - present: defence secretary
    • Feb – Aug 2023: energy security and net zero secretary
    • Oct 2022 – Feb 2023: business secretary
    • Oct 2022: home secretary (a position he held for six days, under then-PM Liz Truss)
    • Jul 2019 - Sep 2022: transport secretary
    • May - Nov 2015: international development minister
    • Sept 2012 - May 2015: Conservative Party chairman
    • May 2010 - Sept 2012: housing minister
  6. Shapps 'muddying the waters' by bringing up hybrid cars - Newsnight economics editorpublished at 10:47 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Grant Shapps

    Confused by Grant Shapps' mention of hybrid cars when speaking to Derbyshire about the government's delay to the 2030 net zero policy?

    BBC Newsnight's economics editor Ben Chu offers some clarification.

    In a post on X, external, Chu says that Shapps was "muddying the waters" by bringing up hybrid cars. The timescale for the sale of hybrid cars hasn't changed, Chu says, but "no one was suggesting it had".

    Prime Minister Rishi Sunak announced last week that the government would allow the sale of new petrol and diesel cars until 2035, moving it back from 2030.

  7. WATCH: Labour wants to see HS2 built in fullpublished at 10:38 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Let's have a look back at the moment Darren Jones, the shadow chief secretary to the Treasury, said Labour would love to see the HS2 project built in its entirety.

    But, he told the programme Labour wouldn't make a decision about HS2 without all of the facts available to them.

    Have a watch below.

  8. And breathe...published at 10:29 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Sam Hancock
    Live reporter

    Phew, that was a jampacked hour!

    There's lots to digest - especially on the government's changing green policies and the future of HS2.

    Defence Secretary Grant Shapps defended both, saying the UK would achieve net zero by 2050 and that no final decision had been made about the future of the rail project.

    Labour's Darren Jones and Sir Ed Davey, of the Lib Dems, also had a lot to say on housing, HS2 and the UK's relationship with the EU. You can catch up on all of that in our earlier posts.

    One thing's for sure - the next general election seems to be well and truly underway.

    We'll bring you any key analysis and reaction that comes our way - as well as some clips from the show. Stay with us.

  9. Rachel Johnson: No such thing as a good Brexitpublished at 10:05 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    In the last few minutes of the programme, Rachel Johnson is asked about the Lib Dems - she was once a member of the party. She says the party must be clear that it doesn't want the UK to rejoin the EU, but at the same time want better trade relations with the bloc. It's an "open goal", she says.

    Yanis Varoufakis and Craig Mackinlay get into an argument over Brexit. Greece's ex-finance minister says there is "no plan" for making Brexit work. The Tory MP argues that the UK is in a better position than the EU.

    Johnson concludes by saying that "we want a good Brexit, and there is no such thing."

    These comments conclude Sunday with Laura Kuenssberg, presented today by Victoria Derbyshire

  10. UK needs a 'better working relationship' with the EU, says Jonespublished at 09:57 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Turning to relations with the EU, Derbyshire asks what a better deal would look like with countries in Europe. (It comes after Sir Keir Starmer told the Financial Times, if elected, he will seek a "much better" Brexit deal with the EU if Labour wins the next general election.)

    "The Tories have had negotiate add-ons like the Windsor framework," Jones says, adding Labour "will have to reset these relations".

    But he insists Labour is not seeking to rejoin the EU.

    Jones says the UK needs to have "a better working relationship" with the EU - and Labour wants businesses to have an easier ride "day-to-day".

    Darren Jones speaking to Victoria Derbyshire
  11. Labour will prepare for government in a 'serious way'published at 09:54 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Why won't Labour "step up and make a decision" on its stance over HS2, Derbyshire asks.

    Jones responds that this is about money, the economic impact and the effect on other infrastructure projects.

    He adds that he cannot make a commitment until there is more information available about HS2.

    Labour is a serious party, he says, and will prepare for government in a "serious way".

  12. Labour won't announce policies 'based on leaks and rumours' - Jonespublished at 09:52 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Derbyshire asks about the financial impact on towns and cities if the northern legs of HS2 don't go ahead.

    "What are the costs of not building it?" she asks.

    "We don't know as the government haven't published it," Darren Jones replies, adding:

    Quote Message

    Labour is not going to announce policies based on leaks and rumours".

  13. Who is Darren Jones?published at 09:50 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Media caption,

    The first Darren in the Commons?

    Darren Jones has been a Labour MP since 2017 - but is fairly new to frontline politics.

    Appointed as shadow secretary to the Treasury a few weeks ago, he was part of Sir Keir Starmer’s September reshuffle - largely seen as a bid to bolster his shadow cabinet ahead of the next election.

    Jones served as chair of the House of Commons business and trade select committee for three years.

    During that time he became a prominent campaigner for Amazon workers to be able to join a trade union.

    He represents the Bristol North West constituency and, upon entering Westminster, memorably claimed to be the “first ever Darren” elected to the Commons.

  14. Labour's turn to answer questions about HS2published at 09:49 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Labour's Darren Jones is next in the hot seat.

    Derbyshire asks the new shadow chief secretary for the treasury about HS2, and whether the Labour party supports it.

    He says the party would love to see HS2 built, Jones says, but adds there is no proper information about costs and timings being made available from the government.

    We're only responding to leaks from the Tory party, he says, and so cannot make infrastructure commitments worth tens of billions of pounds without seeing all the information.

  15. 'I want as many MPs as possible in Parliament'published at 09:47 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Coming to the end of his interview, Davey is asked about the coalition the Lib Dems made in 2010 with the Tories - and whether they'd make another deal with Labour at the next general election.

    "At the moment I am focused on electing as many Lib Dem MPs as possible," he says.

    Derbyshire presses Davey on whether a deal is on the cards with Labour for a coalition.

    He dithers on answering, leading to Derbyshire accusing him of "not answering the question".

    The Lib Dem leader laughs and says, again, that he's focused on getting more Lib Dem MPs into Parliament.

  16. Do the Lib Dems want to rejoin the EU?published at 09:46 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Onto UK-EU relations, Davey is asked whether the Lib Dems still have as strong an anti-Brexit stance as they did in 2019.

    Davey says the party remains "very pro-European", but is realistic about what needs to be done for the UK to be able to work with Europe after the Conservative government has "soured" relations between the two nations.

    When pushed on whether he'd fight for the UK to rejoin the EU, Davey deflects by saying that is "no longer on the table".

    It's going to take time to rebuild the relationship with the EU, he says.

  17. Derbyshire presses Lib Dem leader on homes targetpublished at 09:43 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Derbyshire press Davey on why the Lib Dems got rid of the 300,000 social homes a year target, to which he says the party prefers a community-led approach rather than one which is led by developers.

    Asked if this is a move to appeal to Tory voters, Davey says it's "absolutely" not about that - it's about the party's housing targets.

    He reiterates the stance the Lib Dems have against a developer-led model.

  18. Social housing is focus of Davey's interviewpublished at 09:41 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Ed Davey gestures as he speaks with Victoria Derbyshire

    Davey is asked about his policies now, specifically his target to achieve 150,000 social homes each year. "Is that enough?"

    "We're debating this in the party conference", replies the party leader, before clarifying that the party wants more housing in general.

    When pushed on whether that number is enough - with housing officials saying at least 300,000 homes are needed, Derbyshire notes - Davey says they want to work with the private sector to build more homes to free up space for those who don't qualify for social housing.

  19. Davey asked what he stands forpublished at 09:37 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Right, let's get to the next interview. Victoria Derbyshire turns to talk about the Liberal Democrats and says that the last general election, they won just 11 seats

    But since then they've had four by-election victories - all of them in what were Conservative seats.

    Derbyshire asks what exactly Sir Ed Davey stands for against the backdrop of a "word cloud" - put to voters - which includes phrases from the public including "no idea" and "not sure".

    "We are getting over our ideas, we have been winning by-elections, we have been having success," he adds.

    Graph showing what does sir ed davey stand for?
  20. Varoufakis says UK becoming 'introverted'published at 09:36 British Summer Time 24 September 2023

    Yanis Varoufakis, former Greek finance minister, who's also on the panel, says he supports HS2.

    He also says that from the outside, the UK is looking like a country that is becoming "very introverted" and unable to pursue a large scale financial scheme.

    He adds that great modernising projects very often are very expensive - like the US railways - but they leave behind an infrastructure upon which modern society has been built.