Summary

  • Supreme Court judges have unanimously rejected the Scottish government's argument that it can hold a second independence referendum

  • Scotland's First Minister Nicola Sturgeon says the judgement closes one door but she believes the next general election can be used as a de-facto vote on independence

  • At Prime Minister's Questions Rishi Sunak told the House of Commons that he welcomed the "clear and definitive ruling" by Lord Reed and his fellow judges

  • For a fresh legal vote, Westminster would have to temporarily hand over powers to Holyrood, like it did in 2014

  • The first independence referendum eight years ago resulted in voters saying "no" to change

  • Polling in the past few years suggests the electorate in Scotland is split more or less down the middle on the issue

  • Rallies for independence took place in a number of towns and cities with the Edinburgh event being addressed by Ms Sturgeon

  1. Headlines: Supreme Court rules against Scottish government vote casepublished at 18:22 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    Here's a reminder of today's headlines:

    • The Supreme Court unanimously ruled that the Scottish government is not allowed to hold a second independence referendum without Westminster's agreement
    • In response, Scotland's First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said the SNP will use the next UK general election as a "de facto referendum" to show that a majority of people in Scotland support independence
    • She said the SNP would begin the process of deciding how a "de facto referendum" would work, with a special party conference to be held in the new year
    • Sturgeon accused the UK government of "democracy denial" and said "we will find another democratic, lawful means for Scottish people to express their will"
    Media caption,

    Scottish government loses indyref2 court case

    • UK Prime Minister Rishi Sunak welcomed the "clear and definitive ruling" from the Supreme Court and said Scottish people want the government to work on the collective challenges it faces
    • Downing Street later said Sunak will seek to avoid another referendum while he is prime minister
    • The Conservatives and Labour have rejected the idea of the election acting as a referendum, arguing that general elections are fought on a range of issues and not just the constitution
    • Rallies have been held across Scotland this evening by independence supporters protesting that Scottish democracy is being denied

    That's all from the live page team.

  2. Pro-independence rallies across Scotlandpublished at 18:14 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    The rally in Edinburgh is just one of many being held across Scotland.

    Time for Scotland, which organised the events, said 15 events were being held across Scotland - in Edinburgh, Glasgow, Aberdeen, Perth, Dundee, Greenock, Inverness, Inverurie, Portree, Kirkwall, Lochgilphead, Selkirk, Dumfries, Fort William and Stirling.

    Journalist Lesley Riddoch, who is a co-organiser, said: ‘We have no argument with the judges. Thanks to them, the world now sees Scotland’s predicament. We are trapped in a union with no lawful escape. And the solution – as the judges have made clear – is not a legal but political."

    Aberdeen City centre
    Image caption,

    About 200 gathered in Aberdeen City centre

    Crowds at Glasgow's Buchanan Street
    Image caption,

    Crowds at Glasgow's Buchanan Street steps - scene of many rallies during the 2014 referendum

    Glasgow protesters
    Image caption,

    Linda (left) and Hazel from Glasgow. Hazel says she’s “hopeful but raging” after the Supreme Court decision

    Around 60 people gathered in front of St Magnus cathedral in the centre of Kirkwall on Orkney, responding to the Supreme Court decision that the Scottish government cannot hold its planned independence referendum, without permission from Westminster.

    SNP Convenor in Orkney, Robert Leslie, said: “The myth that this is a voluntary partnership of nations that we’re in went out of the window with that ruling.”

    Crowds in Orkney
    Image caption,

    The rally in Orkney

  3. Key players from 2014 referendum have their saypublished at 18:02 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    The chief executive for the Yes Scotland campaign in 2014, Blair Jenkins, tells BBC Scotland's Drivetime that there cannot be a "denial of democracy".

    Jenkins says there are two vital questions which must be answered by UK government ministers.

    Firstly do people in Scotland have the right to vote for independence and if they do then how exactly do they exercise that right?

    He says if the only way of answering these questions is through an election then that is what has to happen.

    Professor Jim Gallagher, who advised the Better Together Campaign, disagreed saying: "I don't think there's any such thing as a de facto referendum.

    "Let's be clear there is a general election and the general election will ultimately determine who runs the United Kingdom and whether the government changes."

    The academic adds: "I don't think the idea of a de facto referendum works."

  4. In pictures: Protesters gather outside Scottish Parliamentpublished at 17:58 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    People attend a rally outside the Scottish Parliament in EdinburghImage source, PA Media
    Image caption,

    Crowds gathered outside the Scottish parliament in Edinburgh to show support for Scottish independence

    People attend a rally outside the Scottish Parliament in EdinburghImage source, PA Media
    Image caption,

    Independence supporters attended a peaceful rally in Edinburgh this evening to protest the UK Supreme Court's decision to throw out the Scottish government's claim it has the power to hold a second referendum

    People attend a rally outside the Scottish Parliament in EdinburghImage source, PA Media
    Image caption,

    It's a sea of Scottish flags outside Holyrood as independence supports turn out to show their support

    A person attends a rally outside the Scottish Parliament in EdinburghImage source, PA Media
    Image caption,

    One supporter in Edinburgh held a sign that read: "We have the right to democracy."

  5. Independence movement becomes 'Scotland's democracy movement' - Sturgeonpublished at 17:48 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    Media caption,

    First Minister Nicola Sturgeon thanked the demonstrators for gathering to support the "case for democracy"

    Nicola Sturgeon has addressed a pro-independence rally outside the Scottish Parliament.

    The first minister says: "We are here as representatives of Scotland's independence movement, a movement that will grow in numbers with every day that passes."

    She tells them that the independence movement now becomes "Scotland's democracy movement".

    "It has been clarified today that the United Kingdom is not a voluntary partnership of nations."

    Sturgeon insists today's ruling may provide temporary relief on the part of unionist politicians, but they should know the hardest questions are for them.

    Quote Message

    "The Westminster establishment may think it can block a referendum, but let me be clear, I am sure on your behalf today, no establishment, Westminster or otherwise, will ever silence the voice of the Scottish people.

    Nicola Sturgeon, Scotland's First Minister

  6. Two sides of independence debate gather outside Holyroodpublished at 17:07 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    Demonstrators for staying a part of the UK and protesters backing Scottish independence held placards and waved flags peacefully outside Holyrood in Edinburgh.

    Pro-independence rallies were being held in a number of towns and cities in Scotland and a small number of pro-Union backers gathered in the capital.

    Media caption,

    The demonstrators gathered at teatime on Wednesday following news of the Supreme Court ruling

  7. What's the latest?published at 16:56 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    Scottish independence supporters holding flags at a protestImage source, Reuters

    Here's a reminder of today's key developments:

    • The Supreme Court unanimously ruled that the Scottish government is not allowed to hold a second independence referendum without Westminster's agreement
    • In response, Scotland's First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said the Scottish National Party (SNP) will use the next UK general election as a "de facto referendum" to show that a majority of people in Scotland support independence
    • She said the SNP would begin the process of deciding how a "de facto referendum" would work, with a special party conference to be held in the new year
    • Sturgeon accused the UK government of "democracy denial" and said "we will find another democratic, lawful means for Scottish people to express their will"
    • UK Prime Minister Rishi Sunak welcomed the "clear and definitive ruling" from the Supreme Court and said Scottish people want the government to work on the collective challenges it faces
    • Downing Street later said Sunak will seek to avoid another referendum while he is prime minister
    • The Conservatives and Labour have rejected the idea of the election acting as a referendum, arguing that general elections are fought on a range of issues and not just the constitution
    • Rallies are due to be held across Scotland this evening by independence supporters protesting that Scottish democracy is being denied
  8. Analysis

    Analysis What happens next?published at 16:42 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    Philip Sim
    BBC Scotland political correspondent

    The Supreme Court has come to a pretty definitive position on the question of a referendum, and the judges have kicked the ball squarely back into the political arena.

    First off, the Scottish government are hoping they can turn a legal defeat into a campaigning victory, if the perceived unfairness of what they see as a democratic roadblock sparks a wave of public support.

    They would still like Rishi Sunak to sign up to a referendum in the way the UK government did in 2014, and will try to use the ruling as a lever to persuade him.

    If the prime minister continues to stonewall, then Nicola Sturgeon says she is drawing up plans to campaign in the next general election on the single issue of independence.

    The first minister wants that to become a “de facto referendum”, where pro-independence parties would seek to trigger separation talks with Westminster if they win more than 50% of the vote.

    There are a lot of practical questions about how that would work – whether it would be internationally recognised, and whether other parties would take part on those terms.

    But Ms Sturgeon feels it raises questions for the pro-UK parties too. If it’s such a bad idea, why is it the only option she has left? Why not have a referendum instead?

    The judges have given a definitive answer to the question put to them, but the constitutional debate remains a long way from being resolved.

  9. 'Today is pretty devastating for the UK's reputation as a democracy' - Scottish Green MSPpublished at 16:25 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    Andrew Kerr interviews Green MSP Ross Greer
    Image caption,

    Scottish Green MSP Ross Greer was speaking on BBC Scotland's Politics Scotland programme

    MSP Ross Greer insists the Scottish Greens will stand a full slate of candidates in the 2024 general election and every vote will count towards the majority for independence.

    He tells BBC Scotland that today has been "pretty devastating for the UK's reputation as a democracy" and its claim to be a voluntary union.

    Greer says the anti-independence parties need to explain to the Scottish people why they are not getting what they voted for last year, which was a referendum on independence.

  10. Your Questions Answered

    What is a de facto referendum?published at 16:16 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    Philip Sim
    BBC Scotland political correspondent

    Now that the Supreme Court has ruled out Holyrood setting up a referendum, questions have turned to what Nicola Sturgeon will do next.

    The first minister says she wants to find a “democratic, lawful means for Scottish people to express their will” – and has singled out the next general election as the obvious choice.

    That would see the SNP campaign on the single issue of independence, and try to win more than 50% of the overall vote – perhaps with the backing of other pro-independence parties like the Greens.

    If that happened, Ms Sturgeon would seek to use that vote in the same way as the result of a referendum, and open negotiations for Scotland to become independent.

    There are a lot of practical questions about how this would work. Would other parties sign up to the idea? Would it have international recognition as a vote that can actually trigger independence?

    Ms Sturgeon says the SNP will be working on the answers to some of those questions at a special conference next year.

  11. Your Questions Answered

    How long is a generation?published at 16:10 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    Philip Sim
    BBC Scotland political correspondent

    There is often debate about whether the 2014 referendum was a “once in a generation” event.

    Then-First Minister Alex Salmond used the phrase several times during that campaign, and his then-deputy Nicola Sturgeon used it during the final Holyrood debate before the vote.

    UK government ministers often bring it out now, to argue that the 2014 result should still stand and now is not the time to put the question back to the public.

    But pro-independence politicians are always quick to point out that it did not appear anywhere in the legal agreements which underpinned the vote.

    They also contend that so much has changed since 2014 – including Brexit, the Covid pandemic and a succession of leadership changes in Downing Street – that there has been a “material change in circumstances” which justifies a new referendum.

    You can read more about this here

  12. Your Questions Answered

    What is the Supreme Court?published at 16:06 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    Philip Sim
    BBC Scotland political correspondent

    The Supreme Court is the UK’s top court.

    It sits at the top of the Scottish civil court system, being the final court of appeal after cases have passed through the Court of Session in Edinburgh.

    It draws its judges from across the UK, and the current President – Lord Reed – is a Scottish judge.

    The court is also the main venue for devolution disputes, and has heard a series of cases about whether various pieces of legislation fall within Holyrood’s remit or not.

  13. Your Questions Answered

    When was the last Scottish independence referendum?published at 15:57 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    Philip Sim
    BBC Scotland political correspondent

    You have been asking us questions about Scottish independence. Our political correspondent Philip Sim has some of the answers.

    Scots last had a vote on independence in 2014. The question on the ballot paper was “should Scotland be an independent country”, and the No side won with 55% of the vote to 45% for Yes.

    Nicola Sturgeon was a key leader of the Yes campaign, and became first minister when Alex Salmond resigned as Scottish first minister in the aftermath of the vote. There were also two referendums on devolution – one in 1979, which did not produce a large enough turnout for the result to be binding, and another in 1997, which led to the establishment of the Scottish Parliament in 1999.

  14. WATCH AGAIN: SNP politicians react to UK Supreme Court rulingpublished at 15:48 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    SNP MPs repeatedly questioned the prime minister on the issue of Scottish independence at PMQs.

    It came after the Supreme Court ruled that the Scottish government cannot hold an independence referendum without the UK government's consent.

  15. This is a political manoeuvre by Sturgeon, says former Supreme Court judgepublished at 15:41 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    Former UK Supreme Court justice and author Lord Jonathan Sumption delivers an addressImage source, EPA

    Former Supreme Court judge Lord Sumption says the response of Scotland's first minister to today's court ruling "is a political manoeuvre" and describes her as "a very shrewd politician".

    Nicola Sturgeon earlier said she was disappointed in the Supreme Court's decision that the Scottish government cannot hold an independence referendum without the UK government's consent.

    "It enables her to blame everyone other than herself for not having a referendum," Lord Sumption tells BBC Radio 4's World At One.

    "She's had plenty of legal advice - it's obvious that her own Lord Advocate, her top law officer, had no confidence in her own argument."

    He says Sturgeon doesn't want a referendum right now because "she couldn't be sure of winning it but she's under pressure from her less realistic followers".

    "[Sturgeon] would prefer to be stopped from having her referendum by Westminster than by her own innate caution."

    Asked about Sturgeon's plan for the SNP to use the next UK general election as a single issue vote on whether Scotland should be independent, he says that while she can legally do that, "she can't control the reasons for which people vote for, or against, her party".

  16. Court ruling will galvanise opinion in Scotland - former FM Alex Salmondpublished at 15:31 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    Media caption,

    Former First Minister of Scotland Alex Salmond says the Unionist celebrations "are somewhat premature".

    Former First Minister of Scotland Alex Salmond believes the Scottish government went to the wrong court with the wrong question.

    He tells BBC Radio Scotland's Drivetime programme: "The Supreme Court was a dead-end alley and the rebuff is not unexpected.

    "I do think that the unionist celebrations are somewhat premature because there is nothing that galvanises opinion in Scotland (more) than to be told by a London court that Scotland is not really a nation, doesn’t have the right of self-determination and all of the votes that people have cast over a number of elections over a number of years are in vain."

  17. Analysis

    Will a de facto referendum cement Sturgeon's legacy?published at 15:22 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    Philip Sim
    BBC Scotland political correspondent

    “I am the temporary leader of a movement that is much bigger than I am.”

    Nicola Sturgeon was quick to underline that she was not dropping any hints about her job prospects, rather noting that the independence campaign is broader than any one individual.

    But she is the face and leader of the movement and, as such, these big moments tend to go hand in hand with discussion of her own future.

    It barely needs to be stated that Ms Sturgeon – already Scotland’s longest-serving first minister – would dearly love to cap off her tenure and cement her legacy by delivering her lifelong dream of independence.

    The question now is whether her “de facto referendum” idea is one which can actually do that.

    As long as the constitutional debate remains unresolved, the question of Ms Sturgeon’s future will feel up in the air too.

  18. Focus should be on the NHS and cost of living, say Scottish Labourpublished at 15:17 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    Anneliese Dodds

    Nicola Sturgeon should be concentrating on "the real challenges" affecting Scotland - like the NHS and the cost of living crises - according to Scottish Labour.

    "People are really worried, in some cases, about whether they are going to be able to afford to heat their home or provide food for themselves and their kids," says Labour MP Anneliese Dodds.

    “These issues are not being dealt with by the Conservative government at Westminster or the SNP government at Holyrood.

    “That's why it was so disappointing to hear Nicola Sturgeon immediately out of the blocks saying what she is going to focus on for the next general election is again going to be constitutional issues."

  19. 'What is the physical process by which we leave the union?'published at 15:09 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    john nicholson

    SNP MP John Nicolson says he was not especially surprised by this morning's ruling.

    He points out the Supreme Court doesn't make law, it only interprets law.

    Politicians for decades have told us we are in a voluntary union and we can leave it at any time, he says, but he asks "how do we do it?"

    "If we can't hold a referendum to leave the union, what is the physical process by which we leave the union?"

  20. Analysis

    The politics surrounding independence has not really changedpublished at 14:50 Greenwich Mean Time 23 November 2022

    David Porter
    Scotland Westminster editor

    There is now some legal clarity and legal certainty because this morning's Supreme Court decision was unanimous.

    However, it doesn't really change the core politics of all this.

    As we know, the fault-line of Scottish politics is the question of the constitution and whether there should be another independence referendum.

    Before today, the UK government were saying no to another referendum, while the Scottish government want indyref2.

    The law officers and the Supreme Court have clarified that today, but the politics has not really changed.

    That does not mean that today has not been very significant,

    After the ruling, SNP MPs were disappointed but not surprised. The unionists were not surprised and they were very pleased and argue it is time to move on.