Southampton

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As a player, it is tough when you have not won in weeks and you know that everyone you are playing fancies their chances against you.

Teams will take it to you because they want to make you feel uncomfortable and, historically, teams near the bottom of a league do not have good away records, so that can then create anxiety for home fixtures because there is more pressure on them.

It does not matter how that first win comes but it is so important. But then immediately you will be looking at the fixtures and thinking when will the second come?

Everyone is objectively aware of how good the top four teams are, but some other teams are tough too. Those mid-table teams are often more robust.

Realistically, to survive you need between eight and 11 wins a season, but if you do not believe you can achieve that then that is another issue.

Players need to be able to handle any scenario you are given in the Premier League, but unfortunately for a lot of these teams near the bottom, they are so new to it so they can't lean on previous experiences. Lessons need to be learned quickly and then applied so that results start picking up.

But fans also need to look at performances as well as results.

Supporters might be looking at other managers as an option, but the grass isn't always greener - and then what if it makes no difference?

It is OK having positive performances but not getting anything out of the game - because at least you know you are along the right rack. It is when the performances aren't good that you can start to be concerned.

But having said that, no team should be in real panic mode right now.

Nedum Onuoha was speaking to BBC Sport's Katie Stafford

Crystal Palace, Ipswich Town, Southampton and Wolverhampton Wanderers all remain winless after eight Premier League games - so how can they kickstart their season?

Former Leeds, Everton and Leicester striker Jermaine Beckford tells The Football News Show that back-to-basics, low-risk football is their best bet.

Watch The Football News Show on iPlayer

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Goalkeeper Aaron Ramsdale says Southampton are improving and the narrative of boss Russell Martin "being stuck in his ways is nonsense".

Saints, who have just one point from eight games, travel to Manchester City on Saturday as their hunt for their first win of the season continues.

"I can definitely see changes in training," Ramsdale told BBC Radio Solent. "We are gelling more and you can see the relationships are starting to build.

"But trying to get games over the line and being rough in areas is easier said than done. We don't want to be a team that is going to grind it out for 95 minutes. There will be stages of games where we have to be resolute and stay together but we want to take the game to the opposition.

"It is not all about being pretty. Yes, we want to play pretty football, but ultimately it is about winning games.

"If anyone was to come here to this training ground and see what we do day to day, then they would have a completely different perception of him [Martin].

"A lot of the talk about playing out from the back and him being stuck in his ways is nonsense. That narrative can stop.

"It is down to us and Martin can't hold our hands to define moments. I absolutely love him. He is perfect for what I need."

Listen to the full interview with Ramsdale on BBC Sounds

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It is very easy for us to say what teams down the bottom of the table should be doing, but it is the manager who knows the players well enough to decide on what the best course of action is.

Their plan might not work at times, but if Southampton were to change their style, would they be five positions higher? Probably not.

It is about trying to maximise the squad they have and Russell Martin does not see himself to be doing the wrong things. He is just probably hoping his players can start to absorb learnings from the games to move forward with as experience.

The tough part for them is that you cannot live from the highs of games when you are not winning any. But once they do get that first much-needed win they might start managing games better.

Martin knows his team can compete because he knows his squad, but the hardest thing in the Premier League is trying to get points on the board. That is what they are struggling with.

Nedum Onuoha was speaking to BBC Sport's Katie Stafford

Millie Sian
BBC Sport researcher

Southampton boss Russell Martin has been speaking to the media before Saturday's Premier League game at Manchester City (kick-off 15:00 BST).

Here are the key lines from his news conference:

• Will Smallbone will be out "for a little bit of time" with an injury. He described it as "really frustrating and disappointing" for the player and for the club.

• Meanwhile, Yukinari Sugawara has been "managed" in training this week, after coming off with an injury against Leicester City. The right-back will continue to be monitored for the next 24 hours to determine whether he will be available to start on Saturday.

• He is pleased with the reaction his players have shown after throwing away a two-goal lead against Leicester last weekend: "I have really liked how they have trained this week. They are such a good group, culturally, in the way they train and the intensity they train with. I think the reaction has been good - now they have to put it on the pitch."

• His relationship with the club's hierarchy is still "really good", even after a difficult start to managing in the Premier League: "Perception and reality are often very far apart in football. A lot of people made up that it was 'do or die' against Leicester City and that I would be sacked if we lost, but I'm still here. I feel nothing but support from them right now."

• On the "challenge" of taking on the current Premier League champions away from home: "You have to accept they are a brilliant team, with a brilliant manager and players. The challenge is so exciting for us - this is what we all worked so hard for last season. I think the challenge is to go there and see how brave we can be. We want to try to have enough moments ourselves to be able to come away and know that we have given it everything that we have got."

• The gameplan is to "try to win" rather than "try to avoid too much damage". He added: "I think you have to do that. Otherwise, what is the point?"

• Mentality is one of the key things Martin has been working on with the squad this week: "You can approach this game in many different ways. You can go to the Etihad, defend for 90 minutes and nick something - or you can go there, express yourselves, play with courage and try to have moments yourselves. I hope we have given them enough courage to do that."

• He added: "We aren't going to be defined by Manchester City away, but we need to be picking up points against the teams we will be really competing with. We have been so close - it has been frustrating."

• On Adam Lallana's role within his squad this season: "Adam is really involved in the process. We have a lot of honest chats and he understands he was brought in to help on and off the pitch. At 36 years old, we cannot expect him to help in every single game. He will definitely help us at some point."

Follow all of Thursday's Premier League news conferences and the latest football news here

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BBC Solent's Adam Blackmore says it is "not the end of the world" if Southampton get immediately relegated back to the Championship.

Manager Russell Martin is coming under increasing pressure after a demoralising late comeback defeat at home to Leicester on Saturday left Saints with one point from their opening eight games.

"Let me play devil's advocate," Blackmore told the Saints And Sinners podcast.

"One - I wonder can the club afford to sack him and all his staff. It's an expensive business.

"Two - can they get a replacement they really want who can keep them up?

"Three - do they think they are going to struggle to stay up whoever is managing because of the players they have bought and the squad they have got? In which case they may as well leave Russell Martin in place anyway.

"Or Dragan Solak might be going: 'This is ridiculous. I'm going to need to fork out a whole lot more money here and I don't want to.'

"There are a growing number of Saints fans who already, like me, are missing the Championship.

"I get slaughtered for being too nice and too optimistic. If they stay up, brilliant, because I think then they can build. If they go down I don't think it's the end of the world because the ownership is at least solid, they already trimmed the staff and made people redundant the first time they went down so there is not much to change, the costs are less and they built in contracts with relegation clauses.

"I don't think the fallout would be what it was last time because I think they have their ship in order in regards to that in the future. I think a lot of the players would stay."

Listen to the full episode on BBC Sounds

A new episode of Saints and Sinners is now available to listen to and download on BBC Sounds.

BBC Radio Solent's Jono Holmes sits in for Tom Deacon and is joined by British and Commonwealth Light Heavyweight champion Lewie 'The Saint' Edmondson to chat about his new title and his love for Southampton.

Plus, Adam Blackmore returns to discuss Russell Martin's future after a dispiriting late comeback defeat at home to Leicester.

Listen to the full episode on BBC Sounds

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Crystal Palace's 1-0 loss at Nottingham Forest on Monday meant that for the first time in the English top-flight's 126-year history, four clubs have failed to win any of their first eight matches of a league season.

Palace, Ipswich, Southampton and Wolves are all yet to be victorious in the Premier League this campaign.

According to Opta,, external 10 clubs in the Premier League era (since 1992-93) have failed to win any of their first eight games and yet have gone on to avoid relegation.

The most recent of those came last season when Bournemouth, who did not win until their 10th league fixture of 2023-24, recovered to finish 12th.

Before Saints and Wolves did so this season, there had only been six occasions when a team had taken one point or fewer from their opening eight matches of a Premier League season.

Two of those sides ended up surviving - Southampton in 1998-99 and Sunderland in 2013-14.

Football is full of highs.

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And lows.

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Controversy takes hold.

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Moments of madness do too.

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Players become unexpected heroes.

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Some never change.

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There's pain.

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Joy too.

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And, given this ebb and flow of emotion, every so often, even the coolest heads boil over.

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Ray Hunt
Fan writer

The main question on the lips of supporters is how long does Russell Martin have?

This is following yet another Premier League collapse, this time, at home to relegation rivals Leicester City.

The questions were rife pre-international break after consecutive losses to Manchester United, Bournemouth and throwing away a lead at Arsenal. The latest collapse leaves Saints without a Premier League win on a run that dates back to March 2023. That's a total of 21 games and a club record without a win in the top-flight. After eight games, we remain winless, with one point, a concession of 18 goals, and the prospect of defending champions Manchester City at The Etihad Stadium next.

It’s an all-too familiar pattern under the tutelage of Martin - throwing away leads against Arsenal, Ipswich, and a 2-0 half time advantage against Leicester. Much like the Ipswich result in the previous home outing, Saints let points slip deep into injury time with the last kick of the game from a corner, leaving the goalscorer unmarked on both occasions.

Martin was quizzed on his future following the Leicester defeat and showed no concerns regarding his departure. There was a scheduled meeting on Friday with the board and Dragan Šolak. Replying about whether he feared for his future, Martin said: “I had a brilliant chat with Dragan and the boys, so, no.”

Maybe it’s a question of timing. The ideal time to replace him would have been the recent international break, not after one game back. The next international break is between 11-19 November after the crucial games against Everton and Wolves. If we end that stretch with still the solitary point, then it may be too much for a new manager to salvage.

It seems the players aren’t good enough to play the certain style that Martin demands at this level. If they are to pull the trigger, the incoming manager will need the know-how of Premier League survival. The board have a big decision to make in the coming weeks.

Find more from Ray Hunt at the In that Number podcast, external

We asked for your thoughts after Saturday's Premier League game between Southampton and Leicester City.

Here are some of your comments:

Southampton fans

Nick: Saints lost because of another tactical mistake by the manager. At 2-0 up his decision to bring a forward on when forced into a substitution for an injured defender changed the defensive balance completely, compounded by moving Walker-Peters, and further exposing the left side.

Jim: Russell Martin needs to go asap, he is embarrassingly out of his depth. Today’s loss was on his poor substitutions, namely Ryan Fraser who was at fault for the first two goals. Russell needs to be shown the exit door before the next game.

Joanna: Abysmal refereeing, but one point all season speaks for itself. I'm tired of the automatic calling for a manager's head, but something has to change. All the optimism from promotion has drained. I'm drained.

Leicester fans

Mike: This was a season defining game. I’m now very confident we will stay up. Steve Cooper needs to pick Fatawu for the Forest match on Friday. Another win then and the Foxes will be comfortable in mid table. Brilliant performance.

James: Talk about leaving it late! A huge win in what will undeniably be a rollercoaster season for the Foxes, but it also masks a catalogue of concerns. Steve Cooper still doesn't know his best starting XI, with Fatawu's constant omission baffling near enough everyone in football, and Leicester are still second best out of the starting blocks. Strewth.

Brad: What a Jekyll and Hyde performance! This is sort of why you love football. From dead and buried to on cloud nine! Cooper is a genius!

Laura Kenyon
Final Score reporter

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What next for Southampton?

A question posed in the context of one of the most confusing games I have probably ever watched; predominantly due to the contrast of epic proportions between Southampton’s first half performance, versus their second.

It clicked, finally, after seven games – two goals to the good, possession translating into chances, and the atmosphere around a packed St Mary’s was optimistic – almost buoyant.

It clicked… until it didn’t.

How much credit do you bank for a brilliant 45 minutes when the outcome is ultimately the same result: winless in eight.

Focus naturally turns to the manager. Russell Martin looked despondent upon full time. Pressure surely grows on him with this arguably a season-defining moment against a relegation rival.

But presumably with that comes more frustration, more torment. The pressure piling up comes off the back of a game where Southampton did so many things right, showed vast attacking improvement and, crucially, it arrives while they are in the thick of a pivotal run of games.

Chris Collinson
BBC Sport statistician

After defeats over the weekend, Southampton and Ipswich have become the 30th and 31st teams in Premier League history to be winless after the first eight games.

But it is not all doom and gloom for the two newly promoted sides.

Of the previous 29 teams to not taste victory in their opening eight fixtures, a third have still gone on to avoid relegation.

Newcastle in 2021-22 did not get their first win until their 15th game – a 1-0 win against Burnley in December – and ended the season in 11th!

Saints have even been in this position before in 1998-99. They had just one point and a worse goal difference of -18 after eight games and stayed up on the final day of the season.

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On the latest episode of Goin Home with Adam and Jo, Adam Blackmore and Jo Tessem discuss Adam Lallana's lack of recent game time.

Jo Tessem said: "I think Adam Lallana should have come on [against Leicester].

"After the Ipswich game, we haven't really seen much of him which is weird because he was so dominant in that game in the way he ran the midfield.

"In the mental part of the game, it is what we're lacking. We need someone who can demand things and tell people what to do and he does that when he's on the pitch."

Adam Blackmore added: "When you're 2-0 up, you bring someone like him on with his experience to boss the other players around to keep them focused.

"That's the one mystery for me that we aren't seeing more of him. We know he is probably the best player in the squad at managing games."

Listen to the full episode on BBC Sounds

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Southampton defender Taylor Harwood-Bellis speaking to BBC Radio Solent after defeat to Leicester: "I don't really know what to say. Conceding three goals in the second half, it just can't happen.

"I don't think we dealt with Abdul Fatawu well enough, he caused too many problems. That was the story of the second half.

"I don't think it was a problem when we had the ball, it was when they had it. The organisation on the set piece wasn't right and we got punished.

"The next few days will be tough and we'll be hurting, but we've got to prepare for the next game. It doesn't get harder than Manchester City away. We've got to roll our sleeves up because there's loads of points that we have to pick up."

Listen to more from Harwood-Bellis, as well as Russell Martin on BBC Sounds

The latest episode of the Goin' Home With Adam And Jo podcast has landed.

BBC Radio Solent Sport Editor Adam Blackmore and former Southampton player Jo Tessem dissect the Saints' collapse against Leicester, and how Russell Martin's side can recover from the defeat.

Listen to the full episode on BBC Sounds

Gary Lineker brings highlights and analysis from Saturday's Seven Premier League fixtures.

If you missed Match of the Day, you can catch up now on BBC iPlayer.

Listen back to full match commentaries on BBC Sounds:

• Man Utd 2-1 Brentford

• Bournemouth 2-0 Arsenal

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Russell Martin spoke to BBC Match of the Day after Southampton's defeat against Leicester: "I think the sending off changes the game. We started the game so well, the second half so well, their goal came out of nothing. Then Ryan gets sent off and the game becomes really difficult.

"I thought we were better in the start of the second half then the end of the first half. We didn't take our chances to get the third goal. Then someone gets sent off and it changes the whole context.

"I think with VAR I can't have any complaints, it is what it is."

On goal coming after end of added time: "It's the referee's prerogative to add the time on he feels has been added on in injury time. He told our players it was the final action, so we have to defend it properly."

On the message to the players: "To understand what's hurt us, to understand what has put us into a 2-0 lead in a really brilliant performance. But right now there is no message I can give that is helpful because of the emotion everyone is feeling. Give everyone to digest that and the process will continue."

On his message to the fans: "The fans have been brilliant since I've been here. I'm not sure the boos were directed at their team because the team were giving everything. My message is to be really supportive, they've been great."

On the message to fans questioning his future: "I've nothing to say apart from that I need to keep working and we need to win a game of football. I hope they will always turn up and support their team, they've been amazing."

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Southampton have now gone 21 games without a win in the Premier League (five draws, 16 losses), their outright longest winless streak in top-flight history.