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Live Reporting

Edited by Emily McGarvey and James Harness

All times stated are UK

  1. Thank you for joining us

    We have ended today's live coverage of the Post Office Inquiry.

    Join us again tomorrow, where Raymond Grant - the former Post Office investigator involved in the criminal investigation of William Quarm - will give evidence.

    In the meantime, you can read:

    Today's page was brought to you by Emily Atkinson in Aldwych House, and Jasmine Taylor-Coleman, Emily McGarvey, James Harness, Aoife Walsh, Jake Lapham and Ali Abbas Ahmadi in London.

  2. Watch: Strong exchange between inquiry chair and ex-Post Office investigator

    Video content

    Video caption: Watch: Inquiry chair questions investigator Robert Daily about his 'lines of inquiry'

    Before we go, here's a moment from earlier when the questioning appeared to get a little tense.

    Post Office Inquiry chair Sir Wyn Williams asked former Post Office investigator Robert Daily if Horizon error claims were considered "fanciful".

    Watch the clip above to hear the heated exchange between the two.

  3. What happened today

    We're about to close our live coverage. Here's a look back at what happened.

    • Robert Daily was giving evidence today; he is the Post Office investigator who was involved in prosecuting Peter Holmes and William Quarm, both of whom died before their convictions were overturned
    • Daily admitted he was "constantly" told by Post Office about Horizon complaints, but couldn't remember exactly when those complaints started
    • The inquiry heard that Peter Holmes blamed the Horizon IT system for a £46,000 shortfall, but no checks on the software were recorded as part of the Post Office investigation
    • Daily admitted he was "not comfortable" with searching the Holmes' family home before interviewing him, but said it was "part of job"
    • He admitted he had a "strong view" that Quarm should be prosecuted, and Holmes had complained that Horizon was "bloody awful"
    • Earlier in the morning, Daily said he could not "recall" having any training on the Horizon IT system while working as an investigator for the Post Office
  4. Daily can't say who approved investigation bonus scheme

    Catriona Watt ask a question in the inquiry

    Before the inquiry wrapped up for the day, Catriona Watt, representing the National Federation of SubPostmasters, questioned Robert Daily.

    She asked Daily if he contacted his union to raise questions about Horizon being reported by suspects as an issue. No, he replied, because he didn't think to raise it.

    Watt then moved onto the bonus scheme paid to the investigation team - who approved it, she asked. "I can't say for definite who approved it," said Daily.

  5. Inquiry finishes for the day

    The inquiry has finished for the day. It will reconvene tomorrow at 10:00 GMT.

    We'll be bringing you reaction and analysis from today's developments, so stay with us.

  6. What would you say to Holmes if he was here today, Daily asked

    Robert Daily in the inquiry

    Jacobs's final question to Daily is what he would say to Holmes if he was here today.

    Daily says that from what he's heard during the select committee's session with Fujitsu and evidence, he would have been pleased Holmes had been cleared from any wrongdoing.

    "Thoroughout all this we were told the Horizon system was robust," he says.

    He adds that there were no "integrity issues" and "we were getting sent out to continue our jobs".

    Daily says now he knows "it was wrong" and that they "shouldn't have been doing any investigations whatsoever."

    Jacobs then asks if Daily accepts any personal responsibility for what happened to Holmes.

    Daily answers: "No, I was only doing my job".

  7. Investigation could not explain Holmes financial losses

    A financial evaluation report is shown on screen, which says there is nothing evident that would explain how Holmes has disposed of the loss.

    It continues to say that his wife has her own business making and selling wedding cakes - and that the possibility exists that its been used for this.

    Daily is asked if he was looking for money he thought was gone.

    "Yes," he says.

    Jacobs says the Court of Appeal found there was no actual loss in Holmes' case, as opposed to a Horizon generated shortfall.

    Daily says the investigation was trying to establish where the money was.

  8. Daily 'wasn't comfortable' with house search

    Emily Atkinson

    Live reporter, at the inquiry

    Peter Holmes' widow Marion is sat with lawyers questioning Robert Daily
    Image caption: Peter Holmes' widow Marion is sat with lawyers questioning Robert Daily

    It's getting more lively in the inquiry room now as lawyer Christopher Jacobs, for Howe + Co solicitors and representing many sub-postmasters, fires questions at Robert Daily.

    Sitting next to Jacobs is Marion Holmes, Peter Holmes' widow.

    Jacobs presses Daily on the decision to search the Holmes' family house, even before the Jesmond sub-postmaster had been investigated.

    "Was it normal to go through their bedrooms and drawers?" he says.

    Daily replies: "If you're asking me if I was comfortable with doing that, no. I wasn't comfortable, but it was part of the job."

    Jacobs says his clients would describe the policy of the searches as "heavy handed and disproportionate".

    Daily says: "No it wasn't."

    In front of me, those on the public benches - including sub-postmasters - sigh and shake their heads as Daily offers his responses.

  9. Daily 'constantly' told by Post Office about Horizon complaints

    Jacobs fires off a series of quick questions to Daily.

    He points to earlier evidence given by Daily that he did not know of issues with the Horizon system before it was brought up by Peter Holmes during his interview.

    Jacobs lists of a series of cases in which Horizon issues had been discussed, and asked Daily if he knew of any of them.

    "No," replies Daily.

    "You were part of a team of investigators, weren't you?" Jacobs asks. "Did you discuss cases amongst yourselves?"

    "We did have team meetings," replies Daily, "but I don't recall anything being raised about Horizon at that time."

    Daily admits that he was "constantly" told by those at the top that sub-postermasters were raising issues about Horizon.

    "I can't recall when the Post Office started telling us there was issues with Horizon."

  10. Holmes told Daily the Horizon system was 'bloody awful'

    Daily is asked, having had the opportunity to review the Quarm and Holmes case, whether he has any reflections on his involvement.

    "No," he answers.

    That is all from Emily Price.

    Christopher Jacobs, from Howe & Co, a firm representing 157 sub-postmasters, is now questioning Daily.

    Jacobs begins by clarifying whether Daily remembers that Holmes said the Horizon system was "bloody awful", to which Daily says yes.

    Jacobs says that Daily told the inquiry earlier that this was the first time an issue with Horizon came up.

    "With myself, yes," Daily answers.

    In response, Jacobs says his clients "can't accept that you had no idea".

  11. Daily pressed on William Quarm's case

    The inquiry has resumed after a break due to a technical fault.

    Before the break, an unsigned and undated witness statement in Daily's name was shown on screen, where he said Quarm appeared not to be understanding the questions put to him in the interview.

    Daily said in the statement that Quarm had inflated the cash on hand figure in the accounts to match the figure in the Horizon system, in an attempt to disguise the fact that he had taken the money.

    How do you reconcile that, asked Emma Price, with what was said earlier in the interview - that Quarm was waiting for a bank loan to make up the shortages?

    After a long pause, Daily said that "each case is on its own merits". He added that "you've got to understand I was the second officer in this case. I'm more there to corroborate what happens, and to ask questions, and provide a statement".

    When pressed, Daily said that seems to him that Quarm had inflated the cash figure and had admitted to taking the money.

  12. Technical fault delays inquiry

    The inquiry is facing a "technical glitch" and has asked to pause for a few minutes while it is fixed.

    Former Post Office investigator Robert Daily is continuing his evidence this afternoon.

  13. Questions turn to case of William Quarm

    Emily Atkinson

    Live reporter, at the inquiry

    William Quarm
    Image caption: The Quarms ran a bed and breakfast with a Post Office in Paible, North Uist

    Turning now to the investigation and prosecution of North Uist sub-postmaster William Quarm.

    Quarm pleaded guilty in 2010 to embezzling money to avoid going to prison. He died in 2012, aged 69, before his conviction was quashed.

    His widow, Anne, previously told the BBC the threat of jail had been devastating: "The fear in his eyes - I’ll never forget it."

    The inquiry begins by reviewing an interview Daily conducted with Quarm on 7 August 2008.

    In it, Quarm raised concerns about the ATM at his branch and possible errors. He also said he was waiting for a bank loan to make good the £40,277.76 shortage found by auditors at his branch.

    The investigation and prosecution of Quarm will be the focus of the inquiry for the next three days.

    The public seating area appears to have filled out slightly for this afternoon session, so lots of interest in this particular case.

  14. Daily had 'strong view' on Holmes prosecution

    Peter Holmes defence statement

    The inquiry looks now at Peter Holmes' defence statement from 2009, in which he admits to false accounting but denies theft.

    Holmes was acquitted of theft, the inquiry hears.

    "I did not steal any monies from Jesmond Post Office," Holmes' statement reads.

    He adds that he believes the Horizon system was at fault and created the shortfall.

    Holmes accepts he did "falsify documents to cover the discrepancies" but only because he did not believe the money was actually missing.

    Emma Price says in Robert Daily's final investigation report, he commented that he "would see no reason why we should not proceed with the prosecution" of Holmes, yet in his statement he said he played no decision-making role in prosecutions.

    He's asked if he accepts that he shared a strong view in whether Holmes should be prosecuted, to which he responds: "Yes."

  15. Peter Holmes' widow says it's 'surreal' to face Post Office investigator

    Emma Simpson

    Business correspondent

    Marion Holmes

    During the lunchbreak, I spoke to Marion Holmes - the widow of Peter Holmes, who was convicted and later cleared of false accounting.

    She's been watching the inquiry from the front row all morning. I asked her how it felt to sit face to face with Robert Daily.

    "It's the first time I've seen him, I think. It was weird [and] surreal to think he was the one who actually led the investigation," Marion says.

    Earlier, we heard that her husband had complained in 2008 about the Horizon system at his Jesmond branch. He even suggested it could be behind the £46,000 shortfall.

    "The thought that nobody believed him," Marion says. "Nobody that knew him thought he could possibly take that money."

    Missing today is, of course, Peter.

    He died from a brain tumour in 2015 - six years before his conviction was quashed by the Court of Appeal.

    "Nothing we do, nothing we say, can alter that fact," Marion says.

  16. No checks into Horizon in the Peter Holmes case

    Robert Daily in the inquiry

    Emma Price continues examining Robert Daily over the Peter Holmes case.

    Daily was given a series of documents relating to the Holmes case - he says he read them over lunch - and is now being asked about them.

    He confirms that there was no material related to checks on the Horizon software at Holmes' branch. Is that a failure of investigation, Price asks, or a failure in disclosure?

    "A failure in disclosure," replies Daily.

    When Holmes raised concerns about Horizon during his interview, Price asks, did you inquire whether others had experienced similar unexplained losses in their branches or had complained about the software?

    "I don't believe I did," says Daily. He adds that the Holmes interview was "probably the first time" he had heard of anyone mention trouble with Horizon.

    He is asked if he knew about the outcome of Susan Palmer's case - who was acquitted after raising Horizon issues in her defence.

    "No I wasn't aware of that," says Daily.

  17. And we're back!

    The Post Office inquiry has now resumed its session for the day.

    We'll continue to hear evidence from Robert Daily, a former Post Office investigator who was involved in the criminal investigations of sub-postmasters William Quarm and Peter Holmes who died before their convictions were overturned.

    We'll bring you the main points from his evidence here, and you can watch along live by clicking the Play button at the top of this page.

  18. Inquiry expected to resume shortly

    The inquiry seems to be delayed in returning from lunch - we were expecting them back at 13:50 GMT but we're still on standby.

    Don't go anywhere though as we'll have live updates right here as soon as they return.

  19. What is Horizon?

    Person using Horizon software

    During the Post Office inquiry we've heard a lot about Horizon's bugs.

    The computerised system was rolled out by the Post Office in 1999.

    The system was developed by the Japanese company Fujitsu for tasks like accounting and stocktaking.

    Sub-postmasters and postmistresses complained about bugs in the system after it falsely reported shortfalls - often for many thousands of pounds.

    Some attempted to plug the gap with their own money, as their contracts stated that they were responsible for any shortfalls. Many faced bankruptcy and lost their livelihoods as a result.

    The issue was actually the result of faulty software, which wrongly made it look like money was missing from a number of branches. The Horizon system is still used by the Post Office, which describes the latest version as "robust".

    • You can read more about Horizon, and the scandal in here.
  20. Inquiry zones in on transcript of Holmes tape interview

    Record of tape recorded interview with Peter Holmes

    When the inquiry returns after the break (at 13:50 GMT), it will focus on the case of Peter Holmes. He was a Post Office branch manager in Jesmond, Newcastle, but was convicted of stealing £46,000 in 2010. He died before his conviction was overturned.

    Shortly before the break, the inquiry was looking at an interview with him from September, 2008.

    The record showed investigator Robert Daily asking Holmes about his experience with Horizon and how he would rate it.

    In response, Holmes said Horizon was "very slow", and that there were problems with one because it was connected to a telephone line.

    We'll hear more shortly so stay with us.

    Transcript of interview with Peter Holmes