SNP MSP George Adam says his wife Stacey has MS and says the problem with the current system is that it is so flawed.

Mr Adam ask if it is the case that this new Bill deals with dignity and respect but also meets peoples' needs.

Morna Simpkins from MS Society says "yes absolutely" and for somebody with a neurological disease extra benefit can make all the difference.

Bill Scott from Inclusion Scotland says less face-to-face consultations is a step forward.

Image source, bbc

Steven McAvoy from ENABLE Scotland says DLA was better than PIP for fluctuating conditions like MS.

Morna Simpkins from MS Society says she would welcome the criteria to be more confirmed.

Mr Balfour says a typical day is quite difficult to snap shot for some conditions and asks how that could be defined.

Ms Simpkins says MS is unpredictable and the 20 metre rule, for example, does not work for someone with MS.

First Minister Nicola Sturgeon has announced that Scotland’s new social security agency will be headquartered in Dundee, bringing hundreds of jobs to the city.

The new agency will also have a site in Glasgow, with the two locations together creating at least 1,500 jobs split evenly between the two cities.

The first minister made the announcement as she met social security stakeholders in Dundee.

Image source, bbc

Ms Sturgeon said: “Having powers over newly devolved benefits presents an exciting opportunity to create a social security system for Scotland that is fairer and based on dignity and respect.

“I’m delighted to confirm that Dundee and Glasgow will be the locations of the new social security agency. Establishing headquarters in Dundee demonstrates our support for the city’s ongoing regeneration. Having two sites will ensure that economic benefit is spread between the east and west of Scotland and across the cities’ neighbouring areas.

“The agency will also have a local presence with additional staff working across the country that will ensure that economic benefit and jobs will also be spread across all parts of Scotland.

“Our new social security system is the largest, most complex programme of change in the history of devolution. We will continue to work hard to engage with local partners and our innovative social security Experience Panel as we develop the service.”

Read more here.

Tory MSP Jeremy Balfour asks if the witnesses would like to see the regulations much tighter or remain flexible.

Steven McAvoy from ENABLE Scotland says it would be very difficult to create regulations where disputes don't arise.

Mr McAvoy says if the regulations are relatively open it leaves some flexibility.

He says under Employment Support Allowance there is the exceptional circumstance criteria.

Morna Simpkins from MS Society says she would want to see timescales on the Bill.

Mr Scott says in terms of overpayments the wording is not in line with the intent of the Bill.

He says the principles should be stronger so they have to be considered in line with legislation.

Green MSP Alison Johnstone asks if this can be future proofed because there may be a different government in future.

Mr Scott says he would have preferred principles to be on the face of the Bill but if the super affirmative action is on it then it will be difficult to change.

Image source, bbc

Bill Scott from Inclusion Scotland says the consultation on entitlement criteria could have been done over the summer if they had been on the face of the Bill.

Labour MSP Pauline McNeill asks if more principles are in primary legislation would give more protection.

Steven McAvoy from ENABLE Scotland calls for strengthening of elements of the Bill.

Mr McAvoy says it is really important to have the purpose of the benefits in the Bill.

• According to the government the agency is expected to contribute around £125 million in GDP to the wider economy and support around 800 other jobs outside the agency.
• The Scottish government will be given the powers to deliver eleven benefits devolved as part of the Scotland Act 2016 under the Social Security (Scotland) Bill, introduced in June this year.
• The new agency is expected to be fully operational by 2021 and will provide a local presence across Scotland, providing face-to-face support and advice, supported by centralised administrative functions.
• It also provides powers to top up reserved benefits. The first benefit to be delivered by the agency is expected to be the Carers’ Allowance Supplement in summer

Bill Scott from Inclusion Scotland says the charity ran four consultation events with disabled people and engaged online so there was a fair basis to give a response.

Mr Scott says the entitlement criteria must be in line with disabled people wishes.

Mr Tomkins says it is the practical elements that committee members have concerns with and asks where that leaves the Bill.

Mr Scott says Inclusion Scotland had a meeting with the minister and discussed organisations coming to committee to give evidence on eligibility criteria.

"That would give some kind of reassurance that criteria could not be changed easily and without public consultation," he says.

Image source, bbc

Morna Simpkins from MS Society says MS is very unpredictable condition.

Ms Simpkins says people need to plan and have certainty and that should be included in the Bill not in the regulations.

Bill Scott from Inclusion Scotland says his charity does not think the Bill gets the balance right in between primary legislation and regulations.

He says entitlement criteria should be in the Bill.

Mr Scott says disabled people make Inclusion Scotland's policy and he says he would have wanted detailed consultation on entitlement criteria.

He says there was not time to do that.

Image source, ENABLE Scotland

"ENABLE Scotland is a dynamic charity run by its members. We have three main roles:

1. "We are a charitable organisation founded in 1954 by the parents of children who had learning disabilities in order to ensure that people who have learning disabilities have the same choices and opportunities in life as everyone else. Find out about how we are run​, external.
2. "We campaign to fight discrimination and inequality and ensure that people who have learning disabilities are regarded as equal members of society. Find out about how we campaign, external for a better life for children and adults who have learning disabilities.
3. "We are a service provider offering a wide range of person centred services designed to ensure that people who have learning disabilities can live the life they want and actively participate in their community. Find out more about our person centred services​, external."

Read ENABLE Scotland's submission to the committee here., external

Tory MSP Adam Tomkins says he has a number of questions around the structure of the Bill.

Mr Tomkins asks about the relationship between primary and secondary legislation and he says his party aim to scrutinise the Bill fully.

He says SAMH have argued that principles should be added to the Bill.

Steven McAvoy from ENABLE Scotland says some of the primary legislation could be strengthened.

Mr McAvoy says setting out the purpose of each benefit would give a framework to work from.

Image source, MS Society

"We’re the MS Society, external – a community of people living with MS, scientists, campaigners, volunteers and fundraisers.

"We understand what life’s like with MS, and we support each other through the highs, lows and everything in between.

"And we’re driving research into more – and better – treatments. For everyone.

"Together, we are strong enough to stop MS."

Read the MS Society Scotland submission to the committee here, external.

Image source, bbc

Morna Simpkins from MS Society, external welcomes the principles in the Bill.

Ms Simpkins wants to see the embedding of human rights in the charter and she hopes it will tackle stigma around benefits.

Image source, Inclusion Scotland

"Inclusion Scotland, external is a ‘Disabled People’s Organisation’ (DPO) – led by disabled people ourselves.

"Our mission is to ensure that policy affecting the everyday lives of disabled people in Scotland is informed by, and reflects their views, so that the full inclusion of disabled people in to all aspects of Scottish society can be achieved."

Read more about Inclusion Scotland , external

Read Inclusion Scotland's submission to the committee here., external

Bill Scott from Inclusion Scotland says he would consider the greatest strength as some of the principles in the Bill.

Mr Scott says people being treated with dignity and respect are important rights.

The greatest aspect of the Bill is its human rights approach, he says.

Image source, bbc

Legislation to set up a Scottish social security agency was published in June.

Holyrood is taking on a range of welfare powers under the Scotland Act 2016, and is setting up a dedicated body to oversee them.

The Social Security (Scotland) Bill, external will give the Scottish government the power to deliver 11 benefits.

These include disability living allowance, personal independence payments, carer's allowances and winter fuel payments.

Social Security Secretary Angela Constance has announced the timetable for delivery of the first benefits to be devolved.

Under the plans, an increased carer's allowance would be payable from the summer of 2018, while the Best Start Grant, a replacement for the maternity grant to target child poverty, and the Funeral Expense Assistance grant would be paid from the summer of 2019.

Committee convener Sandra White introduces the witnesses:

• Bill Scott from Inclusion Scotland, external
• Morna Simpkins from MS Society, external
• Steven McAvoy from ENABLE Scotland, external