Summary

  • The health secretary tells MSPs Edinburgh's Sick Children's Hospital will not be fully open until next autumn

  • Jeane Freeman says the cost of repairs to the new hospital requires and extra £16m, during her statement on the delay of the hospital

  1. Labour will participate 'in good faith'published at 16:14 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    Labour MSP Alex Rowley

    Labour MSP Alex Rowley welcomes to appointment of the two conveners, adding he has faith they will be independent.

    Citizens assemblies are a proven and effective method when done properly, with a key benefit to explore complex issues, he tells the chamber.

    Mr Rennie acknowledges the purpose of the assembly has been "muddied" by comments from SNP MPs.

    But he says if the Scottish government is bring it forward in good faith, Labour will participate in good faith.

  2. Background: Why is it being set up?published at 16:07 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    Nicola Sturgeon has said she wants another independence referendum within the next two yearsImage source, Thinkstock
    Image caption,

    Nicola Sturgeon has said she wants another independence referendum within the next two years

    The Citizens' Assembly was first announced by Ms Sturgeon in April - but the plan was largely overshadowed at the time by the first minister also saying she wants another independence referendum within the next two years.

    The basic idea is for members of the public to be selected, much like a jury, to listen to evidence from all sides in Scotland's constitutional debate, including topics such as independence and Brexit.

    They will be able to question experts and other witnesses and discuss things among themselves before making non-binding recommendations on the country's future.

    The hope is that this "direct democracy" will help to restore people's trust in the political process by involving ordinary people rather than politicians, parties and other vested interests.

    Read more here

  3. Government has ruined idea of assembly by coupling it with independence - Tomkinspublished at 15:58 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    Mr Tomkins says his party will listen to SNP MSPs in this debate and if the motion becomes a proxy for independence, or any constitutional scheme designed to undermine the integrity of the union, then it will vote against it tonight.

    He asks about the cost of the assembly citing reports of £500,000.

    Mr Russell pledges transparity about the costs in the future but does not name the price.

    Mr Tomkins says the SNP have ruined the idea of the assembly by coupling it with independence.

  4. Climate change or drug death citizens assembly would be better topics suggests Tory MSPpublished at 15:51 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    Tory MSP Adam Tomkins

    Tory MSP Adam Tomkins says it is a matter of deep regret that the idea of a citizens assembly was introduced as a package of measures to achieve independence.

    He confirms his party will support the Lib Dem amendment this evening.

    Mr Tomkins says he is supportive of deliberative democracy because party politics does not get it right and the parliament cannot always solve the problems Scotland faces.

    If we had started with an assembly in climate change, that would be been preferable to starting with the constitution he states.

    The Tory MSP highlights the issue of drugs death, stating it "shames us all" that we have not be able to respond to it, suggests an assembly could also have been established on this topic.

  5. Here's the Lib Dem amendment....published at 15:47 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    Lib Dems amendmentImage source, bbc
  6. Background: PfG - Citizen's Assemblypublished at 15:43 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    Nicola Sturgeon delivers her Programme for GovernmentImage source, Getty Images
    Image caption,

    Nicola Sturgeon delivers her Programme for Government

    Here's what Nicola Sturgeon's recent Programme for Government , externalhad to say on the Citizen's Assembly:

    As part of our response to Brexit and the unprecedented position Scotland finds itself in, we have also established an independent Citizens' Assembly.

    Citizens' Assemblies are often used to help societies discuss significant constitutional or social issues in a respectful, non-partisan manner based on evidence and reasoned debate.

    The Assembly, which will comprise up to 130 members of the public and is run independently of government by two co-convenors, builds on our work to promote participatory democracy and open government.

    The Citizens' Assembly of Scotland will consider three broad questions:

    • What kind of country are we seeking to build?
    • How can we best overcome the challenges Scotland and the world face in the 21st century, including those arising from Brexit?
    • What further work should be carried out to give us the information we need to make informed choices about the future of the country?

    The Assembly is expected to conclude its deliberations in April 2020 and the Scottish government will respond to the recommendations of the Assembly within three months.

  7. 'No one who wants to keep the UK together should have anything to do with it'published at 15:41 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    Mr Rennie says the "real purpose" of the citizens assembly makes it impossible for the Lib Dems to take part in it.

    "No one who wants to keep the UK together should have anything to do with it either."

    He says we do not need another discussion on independence and calls for it to move on.

  8. Lib Dems can't support citizens assembly linked to independencepublished at 15:38 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    Willie RennieImage source, bbc

    Scottish Lib Dem leader Willie Rennie says his party supports a citizens assembly as a way to deal with challenging issues, for example to reach net zero greenhouse gas emissions.

    Mr Rennie tells the chamber: "We deeply, deeply regret that the first opportunity to utilise this tool was when the first minister announced it earlier this year as part of a statement all about the next steps to achieve independence."

    The Lib Dems don't support independence, so how can his party take part in this assembly, he asks.

    He says the citizen's assembly process will lay the foundations for indyref2 according to SNP MP Joanna Cherry.

    We now know the assembly is a ruse to move towards independence, he adds.

  9. Postpublished at 15:35 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

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  10. Climate change assembly to be establishedpublished at 15:33 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    This government will continue to press the UK government to hold another referendum on the EU, we will request a section 30 order for indyref2 and there will likely be a general election soon states Mr Russell.

    This uncertainty does not imperil a citizens assembly; it makes it more essential he insists.

    We need to know what the people of Scotland think he adds.

    The cabinet secretary says this is the first citizens assembly for Scotland but won't be its last - he commits to establishing one for climate change this session, as requested by the Scottish Greens.

  11. Here's the government motion.....published at 15:32 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    MotionImage source, bbc
  12. 'If we had our time again perhaps we would have done it in a different way'published at 15:26 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    Mr RussellImage source, bbc

    Tory MSP Adam Tomkins asks if Mr Russell agrees with remarks attributed to David Martin that it was a mistake to introduce the idea of a citizens assembly as part of package of measures pushing for independence.

    The constitutional relations secretary says in retrospect he understands why people might think that.

    Mr Russell adds: "If we had our time again perhaps we would have done it in a different way."

    The cabinet secretary stresses the assembly will be independent, as are both conveners.

    He goes on to say he is happy to meet with the representative of any party to discuss their concerns.

    The first meeting will be held on 25 and 26 October, Mr Russell confirms.

  13. Background: How will it work?published at 15:22 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    The plan is for 120 members of the public to be independently appointed to serve on the assembly, with the aim of having members who are "broadly representative of Scotland's adult population in terms of age, gender, socio-economic class, ethnic group, geography and political attitudes".

    They will be tasked with examining three questions:

    • What kind of country are we seeking to build?
    • How can we best overcome the challenges we face, including those arising from Brexit?
    • What further work should be carried out to give people the detail they need to make informed choices about the future of the country?
    The Scottish citizens' assembly will be closely modelled on one that has been used in Ireland in recent yearsImage source, bbc
    Image caption,

    The Scottish citizens' assembly will be closely modelled on one that has been used in Ireland in recent years

    The members will be appointed by early September, with the assembly meeting on six weekends by the spring of next year.

    Former Labour MEP David Martin has been lined up as one of the two co-conveners who will lead the assembly - with a female appointment to be made shortly to ensure gender balance.

    Assembly members will receive a "gift of thanks" of £200 per weekend to recognise their time and contribution, with travel, accommodation and childcare expenses also being met.

  14. Citizens assembly is a 'radical act of listening' - Russellpublished at 15:18 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    Constitutional Relations Secretary Michael Russell

    Constitutional Relations Secretary Michael Russell says the last few years of Brexit division should show listening is important and that we must do better.

    "We must pay attention, focus and understand - and then we must act. That is was the citizens assembly is about. It is a radical act of listening."

    This debate is asking MSPs to endorse the assembly's remit, he says, though adds it will set its own agenda.

    Mr Russell says this agenda could run against the government's view because it will be independent.

    Lib Dem MSP Mike RUmbles suggests there is a lack of trust around the government's motivation for setting it up.

  15. Scottish government debate: Citizens Assembly of Scotlandpublished at 15:14 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    Nicola Sturgeon says she wants ordinary people from all sides in the constitutional debate to have a say on the country's futureImage source, PA
    Image caption,

    Nicola Sturgeon says she wants ordinary people from all sides in the constitutional debate to have a say on the country's future

    MSPs will now debate the Citizens Assembly of Scotland.

    Nicola Sturgeon has set up a Citizens' Assembly to discuss the big constitutional questions facing Scotland.

  16. Lib Dems back call for full public inquirypublished at 15:11 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    Lib Dem MSP Alex Cole-Hamilton reiterates his call for a full public inquiry.

    He asks what oversight the government had over the tendering process and asks what the worst case scenario for the delay is.

    Ms Freeman says people can rely on the timeline she has outlined.

    The health secretary says, in terms of tendering, mistakes were made and opportunities to rectify them were missed.

    The KPMG report states that the main issue with ventilation in critical care stemmed from an error in a document produced by NHS Lothian at the tender stage in 2012, she says.

    The report adds this was despite the requirement to also adhere to relevant technical guidance.

    The government says the KPMG report attributes this to human error and confusion over interpretation of standards and guidance.

  17. SUMMARY: Edinburgh Sick Kids' Hospital not fully open for at least a yearpublished at 15:08 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    The new hospital has faced a number of delaysImage source, bbc
    Image caption,

    The new hospital has faced a number of delays

    Health Secretary Jeane Freeman tells MSPs she expects the Department of Clinical Neurosciences (DCN) to move in spring 2020, with the rest of the Children’s Hospital migrating to the new site in autumn next year.

    The decision follows the findings of two reports commissioned by the health secretary in July to ensure patient safety across the site.

    Ms Freeman says the independent review of the governance arrangements for RHCYP by KPMG has found that the main issue with ventilation in critical care stemmed from an error in a document produced by NHS Lothian at the tender stage in 2012.

    The health secretary also asked NHS National Services Scotland (NSS) to undertake a detailed assessment of compliance of all building systems which could impact on patients and staff at the new site.

    This has identified a range of issues which need to be resolved prior to occupation of the building, including ventilation and water systems.

    The NSS report makes a number of recommendations which NHS Lothian have accepted and the Scottish Government will publish an action plan from the board along with both reports.

    Due to the scale of the challenge relating to the delivery of the new hospital, NHS Lothian has been escalated to level 4 in the NHS Board Performance Framework for this specific issue.

  18. Green MSP queries funding model used for NHS infrastructurepublished at 15:06 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    Green MSP Alison Johnstone says the additional cost of this "shocking" case will be borne by the public purse, suggesting this is due to the finance model used.

    There is nothing in either the reports which suggests the funding model has anything to do with the situation replies the health secretary.

    I am keen to ensure frontline patient-facing services are not asked to bear the brunt of any costs, she adds.

  19. Labour call for 'full blown public inquiry'published at 14:57 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

    Labour MSP Monica LennonImage source, bbc
    Image caption,

    Labour MSP Monica Lennon

    Labour MSP Monica Lennon says this project is a disaster and the statement throws up more questions than answers.

    Ms Lennon says we still don't have a clear picture of where responsibility for this lies.

    She adds ultimately the buck stops with the health secretary and calls for a full blown public inquiry.

    Ms Freeman does not agree and insists the priority should be moving patients and staff to the new site.

    She says she does not want to distract from this work with a public inquiry.

  20. Postpublished at 14:56 British Summer Time 11 September 2019

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